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	<title>Comments on: The Limits of Empathy</title>
	<atom:link href="http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/</link>
	<description>a blog by Jim Bliss</description>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-598</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 10:23:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-598</guid>
		<description>Hi there - I found your blog for the first time while researching a post of my own on drugs prohibition yesterday. It makes good reading and I&#039;ll return in future! I tried to find an e-mail address for you but couldn&#039;t locate it anywhere, so this will have to suffice instead...

Anyways, my post which links to one of yours is here:

http://www.infactah.com/2007/01/illegalise-alcohol-jail-alcoholics.html

There&#039;s also a link to a recent interesting radio debate regarding the topic which you wrote so well about recently.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi there &#8211; I found your blog for the first time while researching a post of my own on drugs prohibition yesterday. It makes good reading and I&#8217;ll return in future! I tried to find an e-mail address for you but couldn&#8217;t locate it anywhere, so this will have to suffice instead&#8230;</p>
<p>Anyways, my post which links to one of yours is here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.infactah.com/2007/01/illegalise-alcohol-jail-alcoholics.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.infactah.com/2007/01/illegalise-alcohol-jail-alcoholics.html</a></p>
<p>There&#8217;s also a link to a recent interesting radio debate regarding the topic which you wrote so well about recently.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-597</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jan 2007 15:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-597</guid>
		<description>It is natural to recoil in horror at such things and feel no empathy. However, I would differentiate between &#039;empathy&#039; and &#039;understanding&#039;. Even if rejects the former, one cannot begin to help resolve the problem with the latter. If we dismiss those who understand such things, we dismiss the only people who might be able to prevent (or reduce) their future occurences.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is natural to recoil in horror at such things and feel no empathy. However, I would differentiate between &#8216;empathy&#8217; and &#8216;understanding&#8217;. Even if rejects the former, one cannot begin to help resolve the problem with the latter. If we dismiss those who understand such things, we dismiss the only people who might be able to prevent (or reduce) their future occurences.</p>
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		<title>By: L</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-596</link>
		<dc:creator>L</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Dec 2006 03:44:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-596</guid>
		<description>From what I&#039;ve read, this type of rape as a weapon of war is nothing new.... a well known 20th century example would be Nanking I suppose.  History is littered with examples of this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From what I&#8217;ve read, this type of rape as a weapon of war is nothing new&#8230;. a well known 20th century example would be Nanking I suppose.  History is littered with examples of this.</p>
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		<title>By: claire</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-595</link>
		<dc:creator>claire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 15:31:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-595</guid>
		<description>A great post Jim.

If you can stomach it Amnesty have written &lt;a rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; href=&quot;http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGACT770752004&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a truly harrowing report&lt;/a&gt; into how rape is being used systematically as a weapon of war in may conflicts historically and currently including in Darfur and Colombia at present.

In Bosnia women were deliberatly impregnated so that they would carry Serbian babies as an act of ethnic cleansing.

In Sudan, women who have been raped are often no longer accepted by their husbands and are too ashamed to flee to the refugee camps in Chad.

In Rwanda women were raped to spread AIDS

Rape is a horrific attack on a woman, but these men know the long term impacts of rape on the communities. They aren&#039;t simply raping women to abuse them but to destroy entirely any communities that survive the war and ensure long term domination.

And it&#039;s not just men that participate. In Darfur, the Janjiwid are often accompanied by choruses of women which sing songs to egg the men on.

I don&#039;t know how people can do this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A great post Jim.</p>
<p>If you can stomach it Amnesty have written <a rel="nofollow" href="http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGACT770752004" rel="nofollow">a truly harrowing report</a> into how rape is being used systematically as a weapon of war in may conflicts historically and currently including in Darfur and Colombia at present.</p>
<p>In Bosnia women were deliberatly impregnated so that they would carry Serbian babies as an act of ethnic cleansing.</p>
<p>In Sudan, women who have been raped are often no longer accepted by their husbands and are too ashamed to flee to the refugee camps in Chad.</p>
<p>In Rwanda women were raped to spread AIDS</p>
<p>Rape is a horrific attack on a woman, but these men know the long term impacts of rape on the communities. They aren&#8217;t simply raping women to abuse them but to destroy entirely any communities that survive the war and ensure long term domination.</p>
<p>And it&#8217;s not just men that participate. In Darfur, the Janjiwid are often accompanied by choruses of women which sing songs to egg the men on.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know how people can do this.</p>
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		<title>By: Rochenko</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-594</link>
		<dc:creator>Rochenko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 14:52:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-594</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think it&#039;s a bad show at all -  on the contrary, it lays out a crucial problem with empathy itself.  As the last five years have shown, denying that &#039;nothing human is alien to me&#039; can be a very effective political tool for creating billions of dollars worth of destruction.  And so it&#039;s really vital to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.smokewriting.co.uk/2006/08/11/we-are-all-15-year-old-goths-now/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;reiterate &lt;/a&gt;that there is no gulf between I and Thou, none at least so radical that we can divide the world in two as a result.  But affirming can be hard to do on the level of emotional identification.

Empathy is a necessary step in understanding, but on the other hand evil has a way of overleaping the boundaries in which identification is possible, just as you manage to achieve it.  - as you eloquently point out.  I think the experiences of those involved in conflict resolution (and of psychoanalysts) bear this out: at some point you have to get beyond empathy.  If you force yourself to empathize at all costs you risk turning yourself into a misanthrope.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s a bad show at all &#8211;  on the contrary, it lays out a crucial problem with empathy itself.  As the last five years have shown, denying that &#8216;nothing human is alien to me&#8217; can be a very effective political tool for creating billions of dollars worth of destruction.  And so it&#8217;s really vital to <a href="http://www.smokewriting.co.uk/2006/08/11/we-are-all-15-year-old-goths-now/" rel="nofollow">reiterate </a>that there is no gulf between I and Thou, none at least so radical that we can divide the world in two as a result.  But affirming can be hard to do on the level of emotional identification.</p>
<p>Empathy is a necessary step in understanding, but on the other hand evil has a way of overleaping the boundaries in which identification is possible, just as you manage to achieve it.  &#8211; as you eloquently point out.  I think the experiences of those involved in conflict resolution (and of psychoanalysts) bear this out: at some point you have to get beyond empathy.  If you force yourself to empathize at all costs you risk turning yourself into a misanthrope.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-593</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 13:28:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-593</guid>
		<description>Many thanks &lt;b&gt;Jamison&lt;/b&gt;. You&#039;re completely right when you say that not enough people write about Africa. I confess it&#039;s not my main focus, but having spent a bit of time there, it&#039;s at least on my radar.

And you too are completely right &lt;b&gt;Rochenko&lt;/b&gt;. Indeed, as is hinted in the introduction to the above piece, I&#039;d intended to examine the atrocities from just that angle. I&#039;m aware of Zimbardo&#039;s experiments of course, but I&#039;m more familiar with the specifics of Milgram&#039;s Yale experiments (detailed in all their disturbing glory in his book, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.co.uk/Obedience-Authority-Experimental-Stanley-Milgram/dp/0953096475/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;i&gt;Obedience to Authority&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/a&gt;) and had intended using them as illustration of how easy people can be induced into depersonalising others.

However, as I read more and more about DRC, I became more and more emotionally unsettled by the reports and this resulted in the above &lt;i&gt;crie de coeur&lt;/i&gt;. I may revisit the topic sometime from my originally intended psychoanalytic angle if I can stomach it.

I guess my article is something of a bad show, given that I&#039;m soon to begin training as a psychoanalyst. But hey, it was late and I challenge anyone - even the coldest academic - to remain emotionally neutral having spent the best part of 24 hours reading about DRC.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Many thanks <b>Jamison</b>. You&#8217;re completely right when you say that not enough people write about Africa. I confess it&#8217;s not my main focus, but having spent a bit of time there, it&#8217;s at least on my radar.</p>
<p>And you too are completely right <b>Rochenko</b>. Indeed, as is hinted in the introduction to the above piece, I&#8217;d intended to examine the atrocities from just that angle. I&#8217;m aware of Zimbardo&#8217;s experiments of course, but I&#8217;m more familiar with the specifics of Milgram&#8217;s Yale experiments (detailed in all their disturbing glory in his book, <a href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Obedience-Authority-Experimental-Stanley-Milgram/dp/0953096475/" rel="nofollow"><i>Obedience to Authority</i></a>) and had intended using them as illustration of how easy people can be induced into depersonalising others.</p>
<p>However, as I read more and more about DRC, I became more and more emotionally unsettled by the reports and this resulted in the above <i>crie de coeur</i>. I may revisit the topic sometime from my originally intended psychoanalytic angle if I can stomach it.</p>
<p>I guess my article is something of a bad show, given that I&#8217;m soon to begin training as a psychoanalyst. But hey, it was late and I challenge anyone &#8211; even the coldest academic &#8211; to remain emotionally neutral having spent the best part of 24 hours reading about DRC.</p>
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		<title>By: The Sharpener &#187; Blog Archive &#187;</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-592</link>
		<dc:creator>The Sharpener &#187; Blog Archive &#187;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 10:21:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-592</guid>
		<description>[...] The Limits of Empathy War as sadism in the DRC [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Limits of Empathy War as sadism in the DRC [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rochenko</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-591</link>
		<dc:creator>Rochenko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 09:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-591</guid>
		<description>I too find myself reeling at this, and hesitating before even attempting a reply.  But an institutional armature like that provided by capitalism isn&#039;t the only way of interrupting empathy.

In face-to-face interactions, the strength of one&#039;s identification with an ideology, a social role, or just a set of rules can be enough to depersonalise both self and other - sometimes by itself this is enough to completely override one&#039;s capacity for empathy (the bureaucratic regime of death camps; to a lesser degree, Zimbardo&#039;s Stanford experiments) or is at least enough to allow any latent capacity for sadism to be used for this purpose.

Such structures make an immense propagation of evil possible; but its the impersonality of this (the lack of a core of &#039;evil&#039;, something like a diabolical principle) that is truly terrifying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I too find myself reeling at this, and hesitating before even attempting a reply.  But an institutional armature like that provided by capitalism isn&#8217;t the only way of interrupting empathy.</p>
<p>In face-to-face interactions, the strength of one&#8217;s identification with an ideology, a social role, or just a set of rules can be enough to depersonalise both self and other &#8211; sometimes by itself this is enough to completely override one&#8217;s capacity for empathy (the bureaucratic regime of death camps; to a lesser degree, Zimbardo&#8217;s Stanford experiments) or is at least enough to allow any latent capacity for sadism to be used for this purpose.</p>
<p>Such structures make an immense propagation of evil possible; but its the impersonality of this (the lack of a core of &#8216;evil&#8217;, something like a diabolical principle) that is truly terrifying.</p>
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		<title>By: The Sojourner Dispatch</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-590</link>
		<dc:creator>The Sojourner Dispatch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 00:44:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-590</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Congo Atrocities...&lt;/strong&gt;

I have been searching the internet recently to try and get a picture of what has really happened during the Democratic Republic of Congo&#8217;s recent election. I stumbled across some frightening blogs, articles and stories. I have studied the DRC for...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Congo Atrocities&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>I have been searching the internet recently to try and get a picture of what has really happened during the Democratic Republic of Congo&#8217;s recent election. I stumbled across some frightening blogs, articles and stories. I have studied the DRC for&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Jamison Wiggins</title>
		<link>http://numero57.net/2006/12/06/the-limits-of-empathy/#comment-589</link>
		<dc:creator>Jamison Wiggins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Dec 2006 23:33:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://numero57.net/?p=131#comment-589</guid>
		<description>Great post! Just got here through Technorati, and not sure who you are, but I&#039;m glad you&#039;re posting about Africa. Not enough people are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post! Just got here through Technorati, and not sure who you are, but I&#8217;m glad you&#8217;re posting about Africa. Not enough people are.</p>
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