None of these excludes the other to me, nor does it assert any kind of supremacy over those who are from elsewhere.

It’s just that when I’m in my home I’m, fairly obviously, most at home of all. In the south of England there are a few twinklings of difference. Once into Wales or Scotland, I get that fairly constant sense of ‘being somewhere else’. Further into Europe that sense gets stronger. And, like you, I have found it a big jump stronger anywhere outside Europe (like you in America, I was really caught out by the foreignness of Australia).

It’s not that voting No was ‘anti-europe’ in any way. As I understand it, Gerry Adams led the only significant party in Ireland that wanted a No vote. Yet as soon as the result was declared, he made clear that the Lisbon Treaty had been rejected, but the project for the ‘social Europe’ should push onward.

Time and again i return to the sentiment of Niki Kortvelyessy in the article Our Europe, Their Europe. It was one of those great moments when a writer articulates your feelings and makes something solid and sensible out of what you thought was your own personal confusion.

Phil nearly hits it with the distinction between Europe and the EU. Actually, it’s that the EU is running two separate and largely opposed grand projects.

There’s the social vision; bringing all member nations up to the highest standards in a varietry of areas – welfare, human rights, environment and others – and promoting peace and co-operation between nations that have a very long history of enmity and bloodshed.

Then there’s the business vision; one internal capitalist freemarket. This demands a diminishing of workers rights and a concentration of power to the wealthy.

So when anyone tries to say they are for or against the EU, they are declaring themselves to be in favour of completely opposed ideas.

This isn’t just on the level of the whole EU project, but within the Lisbon Treaty itself.

As George Monbiot ,

the treaty speaks of “preserving, protecting and improving the quality of the environment”. It also calls for new trans-European road networks and a continuation of the common fisheries policy. So if you vote yes to it, does this mean that you want the environment protected or that you want it destroyed? It means you want both. It seems, to my inexpert eye, that there are similar contradictions on employment, economic policy, culture and defence.

You surely did the right thing, to vote against a mixed bag containing some things you firmly oppose. It still retains the possibility of getting the things you like in future.

So yeah… that’s my (very very subjective) response to the question of the geographical extent of Europe.

Phil… I agree of course. And that’s really the source of my chagrin. I want to see Europeans working closely together on a large number of issues, but the bureaucrats and politicians of Europe spend their time manipulating that desire so that it’s leading us down the wrong paths. I don’t see any reason why that can’t be changed though (not that such a change wouldn’t be difficult to achieve).

Tim… yeah, I’ve met plenty of people on my travels who feel just as you do. That’s why I took such pains to communicate the fact that my post was based almost entirely upon personal, and very subjective “feelings” about the places I’ve lived, and wasn’t some kind of cultural analysis.

I honestly expected North America to be a “bigger Britain” or a “shinier Ireland”; you know the kind of thing. But I didn’t find that. In fact, after Saudi Arabia, the US is probably the place that I found most difficult to adjust to on an ongoing basis. Once I’d found my feet in Egypt — despite the initial culture shock — I thoroughly enjoyed my time there. It’s only a slight exaggeration to say that I never “found my feet” in America. The place remained an alien culture to me, despite — as I said above — having been exposed to American culture (like everyone else) for years prior to moving there.

But yeah, I’m well aware that my position is an unusual one.

from this… “i have called three other continents home at different times” i assume you have been there.

asia is wonderful because as douglas adams said ‘assumptions are the things you don’t realise you are making’. when you go to asia there are a lot of things you thought were obvious that get turned on their head.

this is a half response.

i understand browbeating about about being away from home, i really do.

more tomorrow.